The past year marked its 60th anniversary. For us of Action Now-Play old style who are crazy about the good old Subbuteo and old style football, it was a great occasion. But does Subbuteo have a present? Does it have a future? I saw the most recent edition. It reminds me of Subbuteo but it’s no longer the game that it was before. Before, the teams were hand-painted with all the players the same and it was one’s imagination that ave them the names of the various footballers; now they are miniatures of the players with their shirts, all different, that represent teams that don’t exist. And then there are loads of low level imitations. What do you think about it all?
Mark: I think that Subbuteo does have a present – just because it is now not available to buy in its original form in the shops, you only have scour the internet to find many on-line shops that specialise in all things Subbuteo, from early fifties sets through the 60’s and 70’s heavyweight era, which is my era, through to the current competition type figures and bases, which all seem to have different names and which I find very confusing, and to cap it all they DO NOT SPIN!!!! I believe the experts call it “playing in straight lines”, which to my mind defeats the object of Subbuteo! As I said, I am stuck in the heavyweight era and have never moved on I’m afraid. The future for Subbuteo is still there – I firmly believe that. I think the “brand” is strong enough now after sixty odd years to be firmly established in peoples minds. As long as people are still wanting to collect Subbuteo, play Subbuteo on any level and there are people out there wanting to sell Subbuteo, it can continue maybe for another sixty years. Who knows! The recent edition, I do not like to be honest. It has tried to combine the retro flat figures with the photo images which for some reason does not work. I was sent a quantity of this new edition by Waddingtons prior to its launch, and they wanted my opinion on their new product. Of course I had say what they wanted to hear in all honesty, and duly gave a positive response. I repeat, I am stuck in the 70’s Subbuteo wise, so therefore totally unable to give a reasoned and subjective opinion.
Pete: As I said before if it wasn't for these other brands on the market there would be no Table Football. I think if you have to blame anyone for this situation then you have to blame Hasbro for doing nothing with Subbuteo. What these other brands have done is help to keep the game alive and certainly with Zeugo the quality of the teams they make are superb and are very popular with our customers. The new SUBBUTEO DREAM TEAM STADIUM EDITION made by Hasbro is nothing like the original and I don't think anyone would argue that the quality of the products made today by Zeugo, Flickmaster and Pegasus are far superior to the Dream Team Edition. It's ok having a name that everyone knows and remembers but you have to back it up with a quality product. Does TABLE FOOTBALL have a future most definitely yes. Does SUBBUTEO as a brand have a future, only Hasbro can answer this question.
Why was Subbuteo so popular between the Sixties and the Eighties, especially in the UK?
Mark: I think that the game’s popularity during this period is based on the fact that it was unique in the way that there was nothing around quite like it at the time. I think also that England winning the World Cup in 1966 played a very big part in making football more popular than it had ever been and the knock on effect was that everyone wanted to buy and play Subbuteo. It was good timing really! The endless collectability of Subbuteo also played a big part in its popularity. Once the basic set had been bought, it did not end there. There were hundreds of teams to buy, numerous accessories – the list is endless. The correct marketing of these accessories was vital to Subbuteo’s continued success.
Pete: Subbuteo was popular especially in the 60's after England won the World Cup and in the 70's because English clubs were so dominant in Europe. That continued through to the late 70's - it was the Nintendo of it's day without a doubt. Just about every school boy had or played Subbuteo, it was that big. In the 80's the popularity in the game started to die, firstly because electronic game started to come onto the market and secondly the popularity of the actually game started to suffer. I have always believed that if the national game is doing well then so will Subbuteo or Table Football. For example back in the 80's sales of Subbuteo started to drop at the same time the English national team were not doing well and all English clubs were kicked out of Europe after the Heysel disaster and we had disasters at Bradford and Sheffield and also less people were watching football then ever before back in the 80's.
Great footballers often showed their personal support for the game. Many trainers used Subbuteo to prepare their tactics for their games. Other footballers had themselves photographed while playing and taking part in events dedicated to Subbuteo. I remember Kevin Keegan who was one of my idols when I was small. What do you remember about them?
Mark: Not a great deal if am honest! I was always of the opinion that Dad never pushed the endorsement of Subbuteo by professional players enough – but that is just my own view. There are many old photos around of players like Bobby Charlton, Emlyn Hughes, Gordon Banks, Bobby Moore, Mick Channon and of course Keegan playing Subbuteo to perhaps prove me wrong. I just don’t remember their involvement.
Pete: I am a Liverpool fan and I grew up with the great Liverpool team of the 70's with players like Kevin Keegan, Kenny Dalglish, Emlyn Hughes. This was a golden time for English Football when players played for the club and not for huge pay packets. I used to go to all the Liverpool home games back in the late 70's and then watch Match of the Day on a Saturday night. In those days there was no live football (except for the FA Cup Final) and no Sky TV. All you got back then was highlights of certain matches. I remember the Argentina 78 World Cup best of all with the live matches, this was when I really got into Subbuteo. I loved the game back then and I loved Subbuteo it was a very important part of my childhood.
What footballer would you like today to show his active support of Subbuteo? Who could best represent the values of Subbuteo?
Mark: I think that Gary Lineker would have been an ideal person to promote Subbuteo today. He seems to have that clean cut image which would have sat well with the values of Subbuteo. Of the players currently playing the game, I feel it would be hard to choose one, but whoever it was, it would have to be a QPR player - but I am just a bit biased!!
Pete: From a marketing point of view you would have to say David Beckham, but I think Stevie Gerrard would probably best represent the values of Subbuteo.
Mark, I know you are also a football supporter. Like your father, the great Peter Adolph, you are a QPR supporter. At the moment the team is in the hands of an Italian. What do you think about that? I read that Briatore wants to bring the team to play in the United States. From Loftus Road to New York. Do you like this modern version of football?
Mark: The London to New York argument has now disappeared, I am pleased to say. As for Briatore, he seems to be doing a good job at QPR. When he and Eccleston first arrived at the club, many fans expected loads of money to be spent on players to guarantee promotion from the Championship to the Premier League. I am pleased to say that there have been a few good loan deals, with view to permanent, notably Parejo from Real Madrid and Mani Ledesma from Genoa and now the ex Roma player, Damiano Tommasi! I think the club is being run as a business and not throwing money around like Chelsea did when Abramovic took over.
Used you go the stadium with you father when you were a little boy? What do you remember about it, Mark?
Mark: Yes, Dad and I had a season ticket at QPR during the seventies. I remember specifically the 1975/76 season when we were runners up to Liverpool in the old first division, and then going on to play European football in the UEFA cup the following season. Watching players like the great Stan Bowles, Gerry Francis and David Thomas was a joy! Stan Bowles is still a hero to me and of course Rodney Marsh who was at QPR a decade or so before. I don’t think that that team of the mid seventies will ever be bettered - even now with the spending power of QPR’s new owners.
Pete, do you like this modern version of football?
Pete: I have always believed the more football the better, although it may be a bit tough on the players doing a lot of travelling and then playing matches. I love the modern game and the way it is played. The down side is that it's not just about who has the best players or who is the best manager but also which clubs have the most money and i don't think this is good for the game. In England we now have a situation where out of 20 Premier League teams only 3 (Arsenal, Chelsea and Man Utd) are playing for the title with Liverpool close behind. The other 16 are just playing for minor places and this can't be good for the game. This is not what sport is all about.
We’ll end by going back to Subbuteo. I heard that some Table Soccer (the modern version of Subbuteo) players speak of it as of a sport? What have you to say about it? Sport or the most beautiful game on earth?
Mark: That is a difficult question. When people speak of Subbuteo as a sport, I always think of it in terms of being a televised event. Given the technology which is available today, I think it could be televised on a regular basis, which would only be beneficial to the game. I saw on Sky Sports recently that they were televising the game of Backgammon! If that can be done, surely Subbuteo should be in with a chance. Don’t even start me on Poker on TV!!!! The way the game has evolved over the years, and I mean playing in “straight lines”, in my opinion it tends to lend itself more to a wider viewing public. It is more tactical than it used to be and could be likened in some ways to chess on a baize cloth. Which ever way one looks at Subbuteo, it is still a beautiful game, but I would say that wouldn’t I!
Pete: It's a great game that is for sure and there is nothing else like it. However if it could be considered by everyone as a sport then there would be more chance of getting it into the Olympics and this could only ever be good news for the future of the game and everyone connected with it.
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